tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9810450.post330641124606309618..comments2023-10-30T08:55:29.773-04:00Comments on Erik Cassano's Weblog: It's NOT the economy, stupidPapa Casshttp://www.blogger.com/profile/04647758309861590871noreply@blogger.comBlogger6125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9810450.post-43756289683168516342007-07-11T20:49:00.000-04:002007-07-11T20:49:00.000-04:00One quick observation, and I'd like to get your th...One quick observation, and I'd like to get your thoughts:<BR/><BR/>I'm 25 years old, grew up in Akron, and have been following sports and the Cleveland teams my whole life. Something that has jumped out for me over the last 5 years is the lack of interest in the Indians by people in roughly my age group. I know tons of sports fans and I never hear anyone talk much about the Indians, but rather all Cavs and Browns. These people would kill for Browns/Cavs tickets but rarely talk about going to Indians games. <BR/><BR/>Now, I this may be just a coincidence that many I know or come across aren't Indians fans. I also realize many that pay for the tickets would be those of other generations. <BR/><BR/>But I do think baseball is not nearly as popular for people the age of about 30 and under, at least not like it was when my father was 25. <BR/><BR/>I keep hearing about how baseball attendance has been up over the past few years, and that may well be true, but I've lived in NE Ohio, the East Coast, and now out West, and very few sports fans roughly the same age as me pay much attention to baseball. <BR/><BR/>It really would be interesting to do a study of the popularity of sports among different age groups. I think when I'm about the age of 50 or 60 (God willing), baseball will have fallen further down the sports map. <BR/><BR/>Just my opinion and my experience, though. I realize this may not be true or everyone else's experience.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9810450.post-4343338208426924242007-07-10T21:00:00.000-04:002007-07-10T21:00:00.000-04:00t.a.m.s.y--Without a doubt, season tickets are a l...t.a.m.s.y--<BR/><BR/>Without a doubt, season tickets are a luxury. I was arguing against the point that the vast majority of Cleveland-area residents are too hard up for cash to afford going to a Tribe game. I don't think that's the case by a long shot.<BR/><BR/>MP--<BR/><BR/>Minor league sports are a whole other ball of wax. Not only can you not sell fans on a "winning plan," your roster is basically at the mercy of the parent club. Which means, if you are governed by a dreg like the Blackhawks, any player that shows a modicum of promise is instantly brought up to the show. That means you need all kinds of bells and whistles to draw fans.<BR/><BR/>I point to the example of the most recent reincarnation of the Cleveland Barons, which had nothing worth seeing if you weren't a hardcore hockey fan. That's why the team moved to Worcester, Mass. and we're preparing for the Lake Erie Monsters.<BR/><BR/>Joel--<BR/><BR/>I personally think the whole debate over attendance is overblown. Many people have pointed out that it's a trailing indicator. Most of what's going on is due to the fact that the Indians went 78-84 a year ago. If the Indians get to the playoffs this year, attendance will undoubtedly spike in '08.<BR/><BR/>Zach--<BR/><BR/>The vast majority of people don't guzzle sports the way present company does. I think there might be something to the burnout factor. Some people just aren't going to throw away 75 percent of their disposable income going to sporting events. They want to go do something else, like take the kids to go slap giant Central Floridian mosquitos at Disney World.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9810450.post-28829558155987747512007-07-10T14:49:00.000-04:002007-07-10T14:49:00.000-04:00I'm not sure if there's anything I can add as to w...I'm not sure if there's anything I can add as to why the Indians aren't drawing that well. <BR/>But I do think this season (and to a lesser extent, 2005) demonstrate an issue that hasn't been the case much.<BR/>The Indians are winning.<BR/>The Cavs have won.<BR/>The Browns exist.<BR/><BR/>I think, for casual fans, there is a level of burnout when it comes to sports. It may not be financial. But there is a fatigue for a number of people when it comes to sporting events.<BR/><BR/>Most of us that read this site are hard core sports people. But when the Indians had 455 consecutive sellouts a number of the fans who went were not die hards. For about six years, Jacobs Field was the place to be for sports. It's not that way anymore. There are other, newer and fresher options. The Q is practically new, and the Browns exist, so people will buy tickets.<BR/><BR/>Some people just can't intensely follow sports all year. They may go to four sporting events a year. In 1995, all of those events would have been Indians games. It's just not that way anymore.Zachhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00344385023364633170noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9810450.post-85157276990765154722007-07-10T11:24:00.000-04:002007-07-10T11:24:00.000-04:00Recognizable faces: Pronk, Victor, C.C., Sizemore ...Recognizable faces: Pronk, Victor, C.C., Sizemore and now, Carmona. C.C. will be gone. No problem.<BR/><BR/>You've hit on the ultimate debate the Indians will be having for years and years on end, and this attendance issue won't be any different next year.<BR/><BR/>Do they want to spend their offseason allotment on one guy, Manny or Sheffield or Carlos Lee, and forget about improving the bullpen, thus being another mediocre team?<BR/><BR/>Or do they want to improve the team across the board and sacrifice a few posteriors for more wins?<BR/><BR/>Whether anyone likes it or not, the payroll isn't going to accommodate any $20M-a-year players anytime soon, including Sabathia. Or if it does, it won't accommodate that player and a suitable supporting cast to make the team a winner.<BR/><BR/>Somehow, I think Tribe players like Nixon, Dellucci, Borowski, Betancourt, etc. would rather have 20K fans who are going to scream for nine innings than 40K who only came to see Gary Sheffield. <BR/><BR/>I don't think the attendance bothers anyone in that clubhouse as much as anyone leads on.Joelhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13967786036284450804noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9810450.post-88316902851570838572007-07-10T08:09:00.000-04:002007-07-10T08:09:00.000-04:00I liked this article and I agree with you on every...I liked this article and I agree with you on every point.<BR/><BR/>Two points in particular stand out to me: that the attendance problem IS due to fans not recognizing faces, and IS NOT due to the economy.<BR/><BR/>A smaller-scale case in point is Toledo. No matter what, you have to agree that Cleveland's economy does much better than Toledo's, though it is accurate to say that the entire Northern Ohio region is suffering.<BR/><BR/>Despite the economic struggles of many, Mud Hens games are still pretty well-attended by Toledoans. Sure, ticket prices at the Fraction are substantially less than prices at the Jake, but it shows that it's correct to say that fans don't want to do without entertainment, even in hard times. Toledo doesn't, and Hens attendance is indicative of that.<BR/><BR/>On the other hand, take a look at the ECHL's Toledo Storm. Low attendance has caused the owners to threaten to close up shop more than a few times now. Of course, it is likely related to the fact that the Sports Arena is ancient, but low Storm attendance can also be traced to the team losing its identity. <BR/><BR/>The Storm have been affiliated with at least three, maybe four different NHL teams over the past decade. Add to that the fact that in hockey, fights are now generally discouraged, and the fact that no player stays with the Storm for long (probably because they are affiliated with the perpetual youth movement known as the Chicago Blackhawks right now). It all amounts to seeing players that fans can'tidentify with, especially not in Toledo.MPhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05833230465240793728noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9810450.post-22917236390642330722007-07-09T21:48:00.000-04:002007-07-09T21:48:00.000-04:00Regarding the Cavs: I don't think it was that peop...Regarding the Cavs: I don't think it was that people were spending money on Cavs tickets instead of Indians tickets. But the city was so focused on LeBron for April, May and June, the Indians got pushed to the back burner. People weren't following the Tribe as closely as they would've otherwise -- so I do think the Cavs' run had to have had a non-negligible effect.<BR/><BR/>I disagree with you also about the economy factor. Ticket prices have gone way up since the 90s, but the average income hasn't. When the economy is down, people <I>do</I> sacrifice some luxuries, and taking one's family to Jacobs Field (not to mention season tickets) certainly qualifies as a luxury these days.t.a.m.s.y.https://www.blogger.com/profile/14016844718237440155noreply@blogger.com